I was speaking more aesthetically than the actual content of the game. I don't remember what happens in Twilight Princess.

outside of the bloom i think aesthetically it's fine. im just not sure where all the Edgy comments come from. it's not really any darker than say ocarina

This post was last modified: Feb 14, 2017 at 12:00 AM by Draku.

loved tales of symphonia to freaking death(i think i have like over 300 hours on it). I utterly hate its sequel, dawn of the new world.

just bad writing and bad gameplay decisions all around, not to mention scripted levels for the original cast, god what went wrong with this one?

dawn of the new world wasn't so bad imo. outside of the random need for two twists as to who emil really is (one would have been fine, but it was really strange to try to beat at the aster thing so hard and then go LOL ITS RATATOSK ACTUALLY even though i liked the real answer better) the writing seemed fine so long as you actually played it the entire way through, with a lot of nods to things from symphonia that were neat. speaking of emil he's all right. i didn't like him at first but the conflict brought about by the two sides of his personality was interesting and by the end of the game he had progressed well as a character. that and the edgier side of his personality did shit that was hilarious to watch.

the scripted levels for the first game's party members were ehh but at the same time it worked with how often they dropped in/out of the party. the only time it's shitty is at the end of the game when they're level locked to 50 despite being there forever. the thing about dotnw is that it's trying to tell a new story that has ties to the first games' setting and characters, not make another game solely about the symphonia 1 cast. xillia 2 felt like it might as well have been a new tales entry but they wanted to get that sweet asset reuse in, with the only time the xillia 1 cast is relevant being their side stories where they act oddly out of character. (note that im not shitting on xillia 2 here: that game is gr8 but it definitely shouldn't have been an xillia sequel if it wasn't going to do anything with it, whereas dotnw does actually feel like a proper sequel)

another legitimate complaint would be the dub voices, since both lloyd and zelos sound hilariously awful. i feel like almost everyone else that wound up without a returning voice got better VAs though funnily enough. the pokemon mechanic would have been shitty if it wasnt for there almost always being symphonia 1 party members with you so it doesn't really matter. also the stats and skills on them got hilariously silly.

i say all of this having just replayed symphonia and having played dotnw for the first time only a few months ago so it isn't like i'm talking about something i don't remember well, either.

This post was last modified: Feb 14, 2017 at 1:02 AM by Zae Eildus.

loved tales of symphonia to freaking death(i think i have like over 300 hours on it). I utterly hate its sequel, dawn of the new world.

just bad writing and bad gameplay decisions all around, not to mention scripted levels for the original cast, god what went wrong with this one?

dawn of the new world wasn't so bad imo. outside of the random need for two twists as to who emil really is (one would have been fine, but it was really strange to try to beat at the aster thing so hard and then go LOL ITS RATATOSK ACTUALLY even though i liked the real answer better) the writing seemed fine so long as you actually played it the entire way through, with a lot of nods to things from symphonia that were neat. speaking of emil he's all right. i didn't like him at first but the conflict brought about by the two sides of his personality was interesting and by the end of the game he had progressed well as a character. that and the edgier side of his personality did shit that was hilarious to watch.

the scripted levels for the first game's party members were ehh but at the same time it worked with how often they dropped in/out of the party. the only time it's shitty is at the end of the game when they're level locked to 50 despite being there forever. the thing about dotnw is that it's trying to tell a new story that has ties to the first games' setting and characters, not make another game solely about the symphonia 1 cast. xillia 2 felt like it might as well have been a new tales entry but they wanted to get that sweet asset reuse in, with the only time the xillia 1 cast is relevant being their side stories where they act oddly out of character. (note that im not shitting on xillia 2 here: that game is gr8 but it definitely shouldn't have been an xillia sequel if it wasn't going to do anything with it, whereas dotnw does actually feel like a proper sequel)

another legitimate complaint would be the dub voices, since both lloyd and zelos sound hilariously awful. i feel like almost everyone else that wound up without a returning voice got better VAs though funnily enough. the pokemon mechanic would have been shitty if it wasnt for there almost always being symphonia 1 party members with you so it doesn't really matter. also the stats and skills on them got hilariously silly.

i say all of this having just replayed symphonia and having played dotnw for the first time only a few months ago so it isn't like i'm talking about something i don't remember well, either.

well i mean if thats what you think then thats what you think but im a guy that was excited for the game and hopes were high and instead i got...this.

But there are worse tales of games though so, you know dawn of the new world isnt the worst one, but it was certainly the most disappointing one.

one thing i learned though, never hype games.

admittedly since i played it going in thinking i'd be playing hot garbage from what everyone had told me before and instead got a pretty good game, i might have a differently slanted view of it

going in hyped does not generally bode well for judging stuff fairly

yeah it really doesnt, and thats on me but its really hard to get over that once it happens.

That's actually a good point.

Everyone I know who actually anticipated DotNW ended up hating it, while people who discovered it later actually ended up liking it(I think DoTNW characters rank high in popularity years after it came out). Some aspects of DoTNW I like better than Symphonia to be real, and while certain things could've been handled better I think with the limited budget they had it turned out to be pretty solid(though, I wish Decues would've became a party member like they intended). Oh, and tenebrae. Tenebrae is great.

This post was last modified: Feb 14, 2017 at 10:53 PM by Draku.

every skit with tenebrae was a riot, really great character that i feel could have easily been the repede party member of the game.

they intended decus to become a party member? that would've been nice, was alice meant to be one too?

There was "data" that suggested they were both playable at one point, but who knows if that's really true(my source is a gamefaqs thread from forever ago. so grain of salt). Would've definitely been cool to see some sort of side story mission with them

But yes I agree! A lot of missed opportunities but I still like the game. Flaws and all.

every skit with tenebrae was a riot, really great character that i feel could have easily been the repede party member of the game.

they intended decues to become a party member? that would've been nice, was alice meant to be one too?

tenebrae was pretty good but honestly i cant really sit well with the writing other then him, maybe the reason i even beat the game was solely because of his wacky personality.

Cant say the same for the other new characters though.

has the least shit combat in the series, there's a real sense of impact in your swings due the musical accompaniment and the slight hang when your sword connects.

twilight princess does the same thing but better but shhh you can't say good things about that one

oh and also there isn't a 'press a to win' thing like in wind waker

Not saying Wind Waker didn't have flaws (it very much did, and the whole final third of the game is obviously rushed and lacklustre compared to the rest), but Twilight Princess did have two "press a to win" things

But I also found Wind Waker more enjoyable compared to Twilight Princess. The world of Twilight Princess felt like it was big for the sake of being big, and empty and generally lifeless, with a much duller pallet and cast compared to the interesting Wind Waker fellows. (I also hated Midna.) At least I didn't have to constantly hold forward whilst sailing across the Great Sea, and it felt like exploration was a bit better as opposed to just scouring every single nook and cranny.

Didn't help that the Wii version had pretty bad controls except for aiming, and every single wolf section being a complete and total pain to play through.

The only really interesting things I took away from Twilight Princess were the ghost of the Hero of Time (which was neat), and a handful of the later boss fights (which were actually fun, but super fuck that underwater boss fight, that shit is the worst thing ever, not even Gyorg was that bad). Beyond that, it's just a really boring Zelda game. The story and characters just didn't engage me like Wind Waker, and the world is just so bland, I don't really feel like exploring and have no interest in "what happens next."

I mean then again I just hated every Zelda game released between Wind Waker and Skyward Sword so maybe I just don't get it

This post was last modified: Feb 18, 2017 at 8:53 PM by kaZaam.

Not saying Wind Waker didn't have flaws (it very much did, and the whole final third of the game is obviously rushed and lacklustre compared to the rest), but Twilight Princess did have two "press a to win" things

i actually really liked the killing stab thing cus it made it so you didn't have to wait for whateber youre fighting to get back up just so you can hit it back right afterwards and kill it. yea its still easy but it's a lot more elegant imo and isn't just something you can abuse constantly. you still have to almost kill an enemy to use it at all

the other one has the same problem tho yea but atl you have to unlock it. feels a lot more satisfying as a reward for exploration than something the game just forces onto you right away

But I also found Wind Waker more enjoyable compared to Twilight Princess. The world of Twilight Princess felt like it was big for the sake of being big, and empty and generally lifeless,

wait we're talking abt wind waker here right? even ignoring the details i don't see how a tote flat, one-color ocean is more full of life than, yknow, actual terrain and like different environments n shit.

with a much duller pallet and cast compared to the interesting Wind Waker fellows.

yea ok whatev-

(I also hated Midna.)

yea ok get out.

At least I didn't have to constantly hold forward whilst sailing across the Great Sea,

yea my fav part about playing games is when i dont have to play them lol. atl you dont have to play a song and waste a minute every time you wanna move your horse in a different direction.

and it felt like exploration was a bit better as opposed to just scouring every single nook and cranny.

isn't that like the point of exploring? i mean yea wind waker is really streamlined but like who cares? zelda's at its most interesting when it isnt streamlined.

Didn't help that the Wii version had pretty bad controls except for aiming, and every single wolf section being a complete and total pain to play through.

tbh that fishing minigame was some of the most fun i had playing wii but w/e

i don't mind wolf link cus atl hes satisfying to use but yea he does kinda break up the gameplay flow. there shouldve atl been a couple wolf-exclusive items or some shit. real squandered potential there.


im not saying you have to like tp cus yea it's got hella problems. i guess my point and why i brought up twilight princess at all is that i feel that people project problems wind waker introduced onto twilight princess just so they can keep pretending ww's a perfect game even though it really isn't

I mean, I kinda see what you mean with that, especially the terrain thing, but I dunno what it is, the Great Sea just appeals a lot more to me than Hyrule Field

I see it more as Wind Waker's initial unpopularity introducing the problems I had with Twilight Princess, what with it just being a "return to form" that felt very bland and uninteresting compared to games like Wind Waker and Majora's Mask.

I'll concede that Twilight Princess introducing more interesting combat mechanics was really cool though

Obviously neither game's perfect so I think at this point it's just a matter of preference

I don't think Twilight Princess was outright terrible, it's a Zelda game and all the mechanics work, it just doesn't "click" for me

I mean, I kinda see what you mean with that, especially the terrain thing, but I dunno what it is, the Great Sea just appeals a lot more to me than Hyrule Field

I see it more as Wind Waker's initial unpopularity introducing the problems I had with Twilight Princess, what with it just being a "return to form" that felt very bland and uninteresting compared to games like Wind Waker and Majora's Mask.

I'll concede that Twilight Princess introducing more interesting combat mechanics was really cool though

Obviously neither game's perfect so I think at this point it's just a matter of preference

I don't think Twilight Princess was outright terrible, it's a Zelda game and all the mechanics work, it just doesn't "click" for me

I prefer the great sea because while there was a shitload of nothing, every island, every single one, had some kind of sidequest or secret related to it, so it actually rewarded exploration and backtracking.

Contrasting this with TP, the overworld looks interesting, but for the most part it's just a total slog where you ride around on the drill to get around fast because there are barely any secrets or benefits to exploring at all.

You know how people say Earthbound is a boring game but has lots of cool moments that make you keep playing?

That's how i feel about Twilight Princess. Lots of cool areas(The lost woods area, Ice mansion, sky temple, the hidden village), characters(the group of mercenaries(?) you work with later, zant, MIDNA,) and overall excellent ideas just executed kind of poorly.

Wind Waker has its issues too(its short af, sailing can get boring, 2 really bad temples) but on a whole for me it just feels more alive and honestly i think the fact that it is so streamlined works to it's advantage.

Just my 2 cents.

You know how people say Earthbound is a boring game but has lots of cool moments that make you keep playing?

no i dont pls explain these cool moments in the likes of mother 2/eb.

I don't think I've said this in this topic yet, but I really think Pikmin 1 is the superior pikmin.

The threat of the game ending on the 30th day was so stressful and I think that made decisions feel like they mattered a lot more than Pikmin 2's infinite time. In that vein, I feel like this is also why I love Majora's Mask so much. Give me more games with deadlines, Nintendo!

So far the best I can do in Pikmin 1 is like, 12 days.

I don't think I've said this in this topic yet, but I really think Pikmin 1 is the superior pikmin.

The threat of the game ending on the 30th day was so stressful and I think that made decisions feel like they mattered a lot more than Pikmin 2's infinite time. In that vein, I feel like this is also why I love Majora's Mask so much. Give me more games with deadlines, Nintendo!

So far the best I can do in Pikmin 1 is like, 12 days.

Unfortunately, many players are understandably stressed by these countdowns and deadlines. I typically play games to unclench my anus, not be hurried along and eventually fail forever because I guess I didn't do the thing fast enough lmao

I liked Pikmin 3's method best where your allotted time was entirely controlled by your ability to collect fruit. I feel like that's a good compromise between a hard deadline and free reign.

You know how people say Earthbound is a boring game but has lots of cool moments that make you keep playing?

no i dont pls explain these cool moments in the likes of mother 2/eb.

Lmao I know you personally don't like EB but if you didn't think moonside, threed, dungeon man, magicant were cool you're just weird.

Unfortunately, many players are understandably stressed by these countdowns and deadlines. I typically play games to unclench my anus, not be hurried along and eventually fail forever because I guess I didn't do the thing fast enough lmao

I absolutely get this and totally understand. It certainly isn't a playstyle that's for everyone.

But also get good. Pikmin is a real-time strategy game BECAUSE of the deadline. There is no strategy in pikmin 2 because time is infinite. You just throw pikmin at things until the game is over. Its all brute force. All the puzzles equate to one of those baby put the colored block into the same-shape hole games.

But you're right, pikmin 3 is a pretty nice happy medium. A lot of the three-captain puzzles are actually p cool. Shame they removed directing pikmin with c stick.